Now chatting with: Elise
Lyca8:35 AM
What happened to the sword of Laban?
Elise8:35 AM
Nephi took it with him into the wilderness and it was passed down through the generations.
Lyca8:36 AM
And where is it today?
Elise8:37 AM
I don't know.
Lyca8:37 AM
Why not?
Elise8:37 AM
Never worried about it. It isn't really necessary for me to know for learning about Jesus Christ. and God.
Lyca8:38 AM
Is the historicity of the Book of Mormon necessary for learning about Jesus Christ and God?
Elise8:39 AM
The history of the Book of Mormon is necessary. It teaches us lots of different things and helps us understand the people as well as the character of God. It tells us the dealing God had with the people who lived hundreds of years ago. From it we can see patterns and understand how God loves his children and will continue to teach us today, just as He did in the past.
But the tiny detail of where the sword of Laban is now, is not important.
Lyca8:45 AM
I was thinking the historicity was not important. How do we determine what is a tiny detail and what is not? Who decides? The relative lack of scientific evidence for the historicity of the BoM tells us the character of God is to actively make things appear as they are not. Why is it important for you to believe that God is deceitful?
Elise8:46 AM
What do you believe about God?
Lyca8:46 AM
If I answer your question will you covenant to answer mine?
Elise8:46 AM
Yeah I can answer your question.
Lyca8:47 AM
I believe we can all have a personal relationship with God and do not need someone else to talk to Him for us.
Elise8:48 AM
I know that God is not deceitful. Everything I have learned about God teaches me He has a wonderful character and is full of truth, love, and light.
And I believe that we can have a personal relationship as well. I pray to God, no one else.
Lyca8:48 AM
What a contradiction. Just a moment ago you were saying the historicity of the BoM is important which makes God deceitful. So how do you explain your obvious contradiction?
Elise8:49 AM
I don't agree that the historicity of the Book of Mormon makes God deceitful. I think it teaches us more about Him and Jesus Christ.
Lyca8:51 AM
You need to explain why you don't agree. Just saying you don't agree is invalid.
If historicity is important, it is a fact that God must be deceitful because He actively made the scene appear has if the Book Of Mormon events did not occur. Just a fact, sorry if that reality frustrates you, but dismissing reality by saying you disagree takes you leagues away from Christ. Christ does not operate with psychological denial
[Elise ended the chat, breaking her covenant to answer my question. She did not explain who or how we determine which items are tiny details and not important, like I asked, and she promised to answer. The chat session has ended.]
Now chatting with: Mariah and Natalia
Natalia9:07 AM
Hi Lyca! My name is Brooke! How can I help you?
Lyca9:13 AM
Elise covenanted with me to answer my question, but she did not and ended the chat
Are covenants important to Mormons?
Natalia9:16 AM
Covenants are important yes. What is a covenant to you?
Lyca9:19 AM
Two way promise. I answered Elise's question as promised, but then she ended the chat without answering mine
Natalia9:20 AM
I'm sorry about that.
Lyca9:23 AM
I was thinking the historicity of the BoM is not essential to salvation. Elise thought it was, though she said "tiny" details like the sword of Laban's whereabouts are not. I was very curious to know how she determines what is"tiny" and what is not. Do you agree with Elise that the historicity of the BoM is important to our salvation?
Natalia9:25 AM
Do you mean like the geography?
Lyca9:29 AM
I mean the scientific community universally concludes that there is more evidence for the Atlantis theory of the New World than there is for the Book of Mormon theory, which is to say the theories are not rational.
Natalia9:30 AM
The Church does not take a position on the specific geographic locations of Book of Mormon events in the ancient Americas. President M. Russell Ballard, Acting President of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles, reminded members that “the Book of Mormon is not a textbook on topography. Speculation on the geography of the Book of Mormon may mislead instead of enlighten; such a study can be a distraction from its divine purpose.”
Lyca9:32 AM
I am confused. The events DID take place in the ancient Americas and the hill Cumorah IS in New York. Or is it possible all the events all took place on another planet?
Natalia9:33 AM
No the events took place on the American continent.
Lyca9:35 AM
So the Church DOES take a position on the geographic location, it just refuses to refine the location with greater precision?
Natalia9:35 AM
You have to think about the geographic differences in that time as well. There wasn't north america and south america. It was only the american continent. So yes we know that it was here in the americas but where exactly the church doesn't take a position.
Lyca9:38 AM
I see, it is interesting the Church refuses to take a position on something many Mormons declare important to salvation. Again, Elise declared the historicity important. Do you agree with her and why or why not?
Natalia9:40 AM
It's not necessarily important where the Book of Mormon was written, but what is in the Book of Mormon. The land was promised to the people to be a place where they could worship God and prosper. But if God wanted to make any other place the promised land he could do that as well. He's God. But it's the doctrine in the Book of Mormon that is essencial for our salvation.
Lyca9:43 AM
So you, like me, disagree with Elise. The Book of Mormon could have occurred on a different planet. Why do you think so many Mormon missionaries like Elise believe it is important?
Natalia9:44 AM
Maybe it comes from the church culture, but not from the church doctrine. Sometimes people lean unto their own understanding without really understanding the doctrine.
Lyca9:45 AM
Where do you think that culture comes from?
Natalia9:46 AM
I'm not sure. It's something that can occur when opinions get in the way of understood doctrine.
Lyca9:47 AM
"understood" What is "understood" doctrine?
Natalia9:48 AM
When the doctrine of the church is well understood.
Lyca9:49 AM
Why would it not be "well" understood?
Natalia9:49 AM
Our understanding comes from study, prayer, and seeking. Everyone has a different level of understanding.
Lyca9:50 AM
Who determines who has higher level of understanding? How do you know that your level of understanding is better than Elise's?
Natalia9:50 AM
I didn't say it was.
Lyca9:52 AM
So Elise could be right and you could be wrong?
Natalia9:57 AM
No, I said that I'm not trying to argue about this but if there is something else I can help you with?
Lyca9:58 AM
Still thinking about the question?
Who is arguing?
Natalia9:59 AM
Is there another question you have for me?
Lyca10:00 AM
So the question stumps you. You have contradictions you do not know how to make rational sense of?
What are you calling arguing?
Natalia10:00 AM
No it's just not relevant in my purpose as a missionary. I'm here to help you come unto Christ.
Lyca10:00 AM
This is extremely relevant to coming closer to Christ. Your fellow missionary Elise said so.
Why did you throw out the word argue?
Natalia10:03 AM
Is that your purpose for coming onto the chat? You want to come closer to Christ?
Lyca10:07 AM
We are discussing your topic of different levels. You said your level of understanding is not superior to Elise's, which would mean that Elise could be right about the historicity of the BoM being important.
This chat to is to help others come closer to Christ and that is my purpose here. Harmonizing faith and rational thought is exactly how we come closer to Christ. Early Christians taught us how to use eisegesis to do this. With current rational thought, we need to apply eisegesis to the BoM to rid ourselves of previous Mormon doctrine that were dearly held, but nonetheless extremely errant. Do you not wish to come closer to Christ? Your next step to harmony with Him is understanding your own statements about different levels of understanding.
Natalia10:13 AM
Good point. Thank you!
Lyca10:14 AM
So Elise has an inferior level of understanding?
Natalia10:14 AM
Not sure...I don't know Elise.
Lyca10:15 AM
So the historicity of the Book of Mormon could be important?
Natalia10:15 AM
What do you think?
Lyca10:17 AM
I already said I don't think so. Elise said it was important because "it helps us understand the people and character of God". She was unable to explain the contradictions that resulted from this, so her level of understanding might be inferior.
What do you think?
Natalia10:18 AM
Yeah that could be so.
Lyca10:19 AM
How can we help Mormons like Elise?
Natalia10:19 AM
We can all help each other learn together! Are you a member of the Church?
Lyca10:20 AM
I am Christian, that makes me a member of the body of Christ, correct?
Natalia10:20 AM
Yes of course!
Lyca10:21 AM
Good, so are members of the same church. So how can we help our fellow Christians like Elise rid themselves of their dearly held errant believes and come closer to Christ?
Natalia10:22 AM
We can share our thoughts and study more about the topic together.
Lyca10:23 AM
I am trying. Will you help? Can you reach out to Elise and help her?
Natalia10:23 AM
Yeah sure! Do you have her contact information?
Lyca10:24 AM
She is in your missionary center.
Natalia10:25 AM
I don't believe so. There is no Sister with the name Elise here. I am serving in the Brazil São Paulo visitors center.
Lyca10:27 AM
Too bad. Elise can come closer to Christ, but she is currently struggling with dearly held, but errant Mormon believes leading her to a Spirit of contention.
Natalia10:29 AM
She'll be okay. We're all learning. :)
Lyca10:29 AM
How many Mormons are there in Brazil?
Natalia10:29 AM
At the end of 2018 there were about 1,400,000. Not sure how many people were baptized this year.
Lyca10:31 AM
There should be, given all the time Mormon missionaries have been there and the number temples. However, I was looking this up in Wikipedia and the 2010 census says there is less than 250,000 Mormons in Brazil. Why do you think there is such a huge discrepancy in numbers?
Natalia10:32 AM
That's about right. 2010 was almost 10 years ago!
Lyca10:35 AM
One would think that is the explanation, but the Church was reporting more than a Million in 2010 also, so the discrepancy existed in 2010 also. Why do you think there is such a huge discrepancy in numbers?
Natalia10:36 AM
There wasn't. I think you read my text wrong. I said there were over one million in 2018 not 2010.
Lyca10:37 AM
I think you read my text wrong. The Church was reporting more than a million in 2010 also and the census in 2010 showed barely 200,000. Why do you think there was such a huge discrepancy in numbers?
Natalia10:38 AM
Where did you read these reports?
Lyca10:38 AM
Why? Do you they surprise you?
Bear with me, I do not have copy paste permissions like you do.
I take you, do not doubt the census, so the only number you disputing is the Church's own 2010 number. Citation to follow ...
While I prepare the link, question, Does the Church's 2010 reported number of Mormons in Brazil, 1 million +, surprise you when the Brazilian 2010 census said only 200,000+?
Natalia10:42 AM
You can't always trust what you see on the internet.
If you want correct information look on the church website
Lyca10:44 AM
So you are surprised! Interesting. Why are you surprise by the Churches own information? I can not trust the Church's own internet information? Desert News 25 Januar 2010
Natalia10:45 AM
Hmmm..not sure about that one.
Lyca10:45 AM
thechurchnews.com/archives/2010-01-25/country-information-brazil-67425
Well, you are very surprised by it. Lets think about it together.
Natalia10:48 AM
I read the article. That's true!
I've got to go now. Thanks for chatting!
Lyca10:49 AM
Too bad, we getting to really interesting questions. Should we chat more later?
Natalia10:49 AM
I'm here to help!
Bye!
Lyca10:40 AM
Will you give me your chat info to continue the discussion later?
[She ended the chat without giving her chat info]
-----------------------------
Now chatting with: Angela and Ella and Kaylee
Angela7:33 PM
Hi Miles! How can I help you?
Miles7:34 PM
Question. The Book of Mormon tells a story of different civilizations arriving by boat to the Western hemisphere before Columbus. Shouldn't there be evidence of this?
Angela7:34 PM
I have a video that explains the evidence of the Book of Mormon, but at the end of the day, you have to pray to know if it is true. Just as you would know if the Bible is the word of God:)
Miles7:38 PM
Of course, the Book of Mormon is the word of God. That is completely different than whether or not civilizations were arriving by boat before Columbus. Even people who do not consider the Bible the word of God concede there is evidence of Israelite civilization before Roman rule of Palestine.
Angela7:40 PM
Here is the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v50HiWcLnSs. Columbus was not the first one to America, there were Native Americans already in America at that point.
Miles7:41 PM
Of course, Native Americans were already in the Western hemisphere before Columbus. Does anyone dispute that?
Angela7:42 PM
I am unsure what you're confused about
Miles7:43 PM
I am not sure I am the one confused.
I have never met anyone who does not think Native Americans were already in the Western Hemisphere before Columbus. I am not sure why you state that fact to me when this is universally acknowledged.
Angela7:45 PM
I thought that was your question;) Could you maybe restate what you wanted to know about
Miles7:46 PM
Sorry, your chat app has copy and paste blocked so I will have to retype it.
Angela7:46 PM
Sorry, we could not be of more help to you today Miles. I hope you have a spectacular day:)
Miles7:47 PM
The BoM tells a story of different civilizations that came by boat to the western hemisphere before Columbus. Shouldn't there be evidence of this?
Kaylee7:48 PM
Miles, there is evidence of the Book of Mormon civilization. We sent you a video explaining some, and there are many others.
Miles7:49 PM
I am listening to the video now. So far Christofferson is not mentioning the evidence. So far your definition of evidence is not like everyone else's.
Miles7:50 PM
There is more evidence for an Atlantis theory of the New World and science does not consider the Atlantis theory valid.
Kaylee7:50 PM
The video gets into it a little later
Miles7:50 PM
So you are saying there should be evidence. The only way you deal with the lack of evidence is to manipulate the definition of evidence.
Interestingly, you admit there should be evidence. But sorry, your new and tortured definition of evidence is not in agreement with the modern understanding of scientific methodologies, epistemology, or academia
What you are explaining to me is that you agree there should be evidence and you have to play games with the definition of evidence to make yourself feel better about the fact there is no significant evidence.
[They ended the chat session]
Now chatting with: Angela and Kaylee
mILES7:55 PM
I am watching the Christofferson video.
mILES7:55 PM
I found it fascinating that he complains with a quote
[They hung up the chat]
Now chatting with: Aurelia and Katelynn
Miles7:56 PM
quote
Miles7:56 PM
from critics complaining the BoM is the only book one need not read to have an opinion about it.
Miles7:57 PM
Funny Christoferson would complain about this when Mormon missionaries frequently instruct people to read one verse and then pray about the Book of Mormon to have an opinion about the Book of Mormon.
[They ended the chat session}
Now chatting with: Aurelia and Katelynn
Miles 7:59
18 mintues into 30 mintues of the video and still no evidence of civilizations arriving by boat before Columbus
8:00 PM
It seems to me you would have been better off suggesting there is no evidence because the land of the book of Mormon could have been swallowed underwater.
[They ended the chat]
Now chatting with: Riah and Sarah
Miles8:03 PM
20 mintues of 30 and still no evidence.
Obvious this video has no evidence. Instead of ending the chat why not just provide an video that does. Are all Mormons taught to violate their covenant to be honest with the fellow man?
Miles8:06 PM
Are Mormons all taught to be so dishonest, providing fake video links for evidence, when in their heart of hearts they know there is no evidence?
[They ended the Chat]
Now chatting with: Angela and Ella and Kaylee
Miles8:12 PM
I finished the video and it provided zero evidence of civilization arriving by boat before Columbus. Fact is you lied and ran away.
[They ended the chat]
Now chatting with: Rebekah and Wen
Jennifer 9:37 AM
Question, why is there more scientific evidence for Atlantis theories of the New World than there is for the Book of Mormon theory of the New World?
Rebekah9:38 AM
I'm not sure, have you ever read the Book of Mormon?
Jennifer9:39 AM
Yes. If it is real, should not there be more evidence for it than debunked theories such as the Atlantis theory?
Jennifer9:42 AM
You left the chat. Is that your way of answering yes to the question?
[They left without ending the chat]
Now chatting with: Ezrie and Hannah
Ezrie3:49 PM
Hello!
Teresa3:51 PM
Hi. Question, why is there more evidence for Atlantis type theories for New / Old World connection than there is for Book of Mormon theories of the New / Old World?
Ezrie3:52 PM
I don't quite understated what you are asking
Teresa3:52 PM
The Book of Mormon has this theory of connection between the New World and the Old World, correct?
Ezrie3:53 PM
Do you mean the Old and New testament?
Teresa3:54 PM
The Western Hemisphere is sometimes referred to as the New World, everything else by default is usually referred as the Old World.
The Book of Mormon has a theory of connection between the two worlds that pre-dates Christopher Columbus, correct?
Ezrie3:56 PM
The Book of Mormon tells a story of a family that sailed from Jerusalem to the American contents.
Teresa3:58 PM
Correct. In fact it is more than a single family, but families at different time periods that turn into major civilizations. This is what would be called an Old World / New World connection that pre-dates Christopher Columbus. Is it not?
Ezrie3:59 PM
I belive so.
Teresa4:01 PM
Such theories were popular at the time of the Book of Mormon publication. Another such theory of the time was the Atlantis theory, that involved the New World being populated by the lost island Atlantis composed of pre-ancient Greek people.
Today the Atlantis theory is not considered scientifically sound. Why is there more evidence for the Atlantis theory than there is for the BoM?
Ezrie4:02 PM
I don't know the answer to your question.
Maybe it is something we need to pray about to receive for ourselves the answer to whether or not it is true.
Teresa4:04 PM
But what do you mean by true? For example, despite being made up, the Spirit tells us the parables of Jesus are true. The Spirit does not testify to that type of thing. The Spirit testifies of moral of stories, not to trivial things like historicity.
Many people once confuse the Spirit answering their prays that the Nephites had metal, chariots, horses, and as the principal ancestors of the Native Americans, only to be later corrected by the LDS Church that the Spirit never testified of these things, the Spirit was only answering that these peoples prayers as BoM morals being true.
Ezrie4:10 PM
The spirit can testify of all truth both moral, spiritual, and physical. Heavenly Father is the Father of everything even things such as history and Math. The Spirit can testify of their truth just and much as the truth of Moral stories. My job here is not to argue with people about their beliefs. I am unsure whether or not I have answered your question but I have to go now. But I encourage you to Pray and find out for yourself who the Spirit is and what he can do.
Teresa4:11 PM
Plus, the Spirit and sound reasoning should be in harmony. If sound reasoning tells us the Atlantis theory is more valid than BoM historicity claims, the Spirit is clearly not testifying of historicity, but morals.
You have not answered by question at all. What you have done is demonstrated that you do not have the slightest clue as to why the BoM historicity does not makes sense or sound reasoning. I am not here to argue, but I am here to help you come closer to Christ by bring your interpretation of the Spirit in harmony with the intellectual faculties that God has given you. I am sorry I was not able to help you come closer to Christ ... may be you can find the desire another day.
[Ezrie ended the chat]
Now chatting with: Skylee
Skylee8:08 PM
Hi Teresa. How are you doing today?
Teresa8:09 PM
I am well. And you?
Skylee8:09 PM
I'm doing fantastic! Thanks for asking. What can I help you with today?
Teresa8:10 PM
How does a person know if they are interpreting the Spirit correctly?
Teresa8:17 PM
Hello?
Skylee8:18 PM
Wow! What a great question!!! So sorry I took so long to respond. I totally know how you feel Teresa. There are so many times in my life where I wondered this very question and one thing that's really helped me is a quote that I heard from one of our church leaders. They said, if you have a good thought and it invites you to do good and come closer to Christ, it is from the spirit!
Teresa8:22 PM
Yeah I know what you mean. So many Mormons have told me they had a good thought and it invited them to come closer to Christ. For example, they thought that the Lamanites were the principal ancestors of the Native Americans, but then the LDS Church told them they were misinterpreting the Spirit. Why would that be?
Skylee8:23 PM
I'm super sorry, I'm not exactly sure what you are referencing, but if you could give me some scriptures I might be able to look more into that. I do know that we can only receive promptings from the spirit when we are living worthy and keeping the commandments
Skylee8:25 PM
In the introduction to the Book of Mormon, it says "The record (the Book of Mormon) gives an account of two great civilizations. One came from Jerusalem in 600 B.C. and afterward separated into two nations, known as the Nephites and the Lamanites. The other came much earlier when the Lord confounded the tongues at the Tower of Babel. This group is known as the Jaredites. After thousands of years, all were destroyed except the Lamanites, and they are among the ancestors of the American Indians."
Teresa8:27 PM
Oh, wow. So your answer is that all those Mormons that read the Book of Mormon and believed the previous official position of the LDS Church that the Lamanites described in the introduction to the Book of Mormon were the principal ancestors of the Native Americans were all not living a worthy life and keeping the commandments. Interesting you would claim that . Lets chat more about that.
This would mean that even the inspired authors of the previous introduction to the BoM were not living worthy lives and keeping the commandments. But, no one is living a worthy life and keeping the commandments, so no one is interpreting the Spirit correctly, at least according to what you just said.
Skylee8:29 PM
I'm sorry, I don't think I understood you. The Lamanites are indeed ancestors of the Native Americans
Teresa8:30 PM
How old are you Skylee? It was only about 6 years ago that the introduction change principal to among.
Skylee8:30 PM
I am 21 years old. Can I ask where you are getting your information?
Teresa8:32 PM
The BoM itself. My says "principal", not "among". Are you seriously pretending you did not know this? Has this truth really been hidden from you? How old is your BoM?
Skylee8:36 PM
The introduction does get updated because it is not doctrine. It is highly inspired but the only thing that doesn't change is doctrine. The truth did not get hidden from me. This is not a piece of information that is necessary for salvation
Teresa8:43 PM
So, just a moment ago, you were insincerely pretending to not know what I was talking about, and now you are admitting you knew exactly what I was referring to. Interesting. The only doctrine that is official is that Jesus is the savior, all other things are appendages. As you admit it is highly inspired, and that is how I referred to it, an official position. But again the question was about interpreting the Spirit. The fact remains that according to the LDS Church many, many Mormons misinterpreted the Spirit to mean the Lamanites were the principal ancestors of Native Americans. If they misinterpreted that, then they could just as well be misinterpreting "among" or even ancestors. In fact to believe they are ancestors you HAVE to believe that God deliberately manipulated the science to make evidence for the Atlantis Theories of the New World more believable than BoM theories, and no scientist believes Atlantis Theories anymore.
Skylee8:44 PM
Okay, thank you for your time, have a nice night!
[Skylee exited the chat without answering the question The chat session has ended.]
A representative will join the chat once you send a message.
Teresa8:50 PM
Skylee is not going to the answer the question about interpreting the Spirit.
Now chatting with: Abish and Wiramina
Abish8:52 PM
Do you know what is the fruits of the Spirit?!
Teresa8:55 PM
There are 9 attributes in Galatians, among them Joy, Peace etc .
Abish8:55 PM
Exactly Galatians 5:22-23
Teresa8:56 PM
The question is if you ask the Spirit if the parables of Jesus were real or made up, what will the Spirit tell you.
Abish8:57 PM
Do you know who is Jesus right?!
Teresa8:58 PM
The Spirit tells us the parables are true, but most opinions say the parables were made up. Truth is truth so the Spirit should give everyone the same answer. Therefore someone is misinterpreting the Spirit. The Spirit tells most all of humanity that the BoM is true, but made up, like the parables of Jesus. So someone is clearly misinterpreting the Spirit.
Abish8:59 PM
So first, Parable is a simple story used to illustrate and teach a spiritual truth or principle. A parable is based on comparing an ordinary object or event to a truth, and the underlying meaning or message of a parable is often hidden to listeners who are not spiritually prepared to receive it ( Matt. 13:10–17).
Teresa8:59 PM
And second?
Abish9:00 PM
So you are saying that the Bible is made up too!? Can you explain what you are saying please?
Teresa9:01 PM
How did you get that out of what I chatted?
Abish9:01 PM
Explain
Teresa9:01 PM
I am talking about misinterpreting the Spirit.
The LDS Church has informed Mormons that they misinterpreted the Spirit when they thought the Spirit told them Lamanites were the "principal" ancestors of the Native Americans and not just "among". For your bible question, that would like saying Jesus was not born in Bethlehem, but Jerusalem.
Abish9:06 PM
the Spirit is a third member of the Godhead (1 John. 5:7). He is a personage of Spirit, not having a body of flesh and bones.The Holy Ghost is often referred to as the Spirit, or the Spirit of God. The Holy Ghost performs several vital roles in the plan of salvation. He bears witness of the Father and the Son (1 Cor. 12:3). He reveals the truth of all things (John 14:26; 16:13; Moro. 10:5; D&C 39:6).
Abish9:06 PM
And I can feel like that you miss understand a lot of little points! But if you would like we can try to explain to you all by explaining the beginning of it! When Jesus Christ was on earth and basically what we believe!
Teresa9:10 PM
You appear to be deliberating arguing past the question I actually asked. Mormons thought the Spirit told the truth of something and now the LDS church has told them they were wrong. So Mormons must have misinterpreted the Spirit they were so sure was telling them the truth of all things.
Abish9:10 PM
We believe that the by the power of the Holy Ghost we can know the truth of all things, yes !!! And usually how do we know is true we have this warm Felling in our heart who tell us hat is true!
Teresa9:14 PM
I know exactly. That is the whole point of the question. The Spirit is a warm feeling. So, with a mass of data, it is hard to know in what the warm feeling is referring to. For example, in the parable of Jesus, the warm feeling is testifying of the moral, not the details of the actual story being real events.
Abish9:15 PM
The parables he used are here to help us to understand the principles that he want us to apply in our life, which are true!
Teresa9:19 PM
Bingo.
Abish9:20 PM
But did you feel this warm feelings before?
Teresa9:20 PM
All the time. So, like Skylee, you don't know how to answer the question either?
Abish9:21 PM
No so sorry about it! can you explain more please?! And if you feel this warm feeling it just mean that is true!
Teresa9:24 PM
One more time. Mormons misinterpreted the Spirit to mean the Lamanites were the principal ancestors of the Native Americans, when in fact they were the only among. The answer the warm feeling was providing was confused.
Teresa9:32 PM
Hello?
Wiramina9:32 PM
Yes, sorry, one moment as we write a response :)
Wiramina9:33 PM
That's true, Early Church members considered all American Indians to be direct descendants of Book of Mormon peoples. The introduction to the Book of Mormon clarifies that Lamanites were “among the ancestors of the American Indians.” Title page of the Book of Mormon.
Teresa9:35 PM
Yes, and just six years ago it clarified "principal". The Title page said "principal" just a few years ago. You didn't know that?
Wiramina9:35 PM
No, I didn't know that. In what context was the word "principal" used?
Abish9:37 PM
And where
Abish9:37 PM
???
Teresa9:37 PM
Wow. The exact title page was changed just a few years ago, from "principal" to "among"
Teresa9:37 PM
How old is your Book of Mormon?
Abish9:39 PM
So you do have a book of Mormon?!
Teresa9:40 PM
Yes. And my says principal, not among. How long have you been Mormon?
Teresa9:44 PM
Hello?
Wiramina9:44 PM
Yes, true. Well, is this the only concern you may have? It is true that there are still corrections being made in the Book of Mormon, but I know that it is true because of the warm feeling we spoke about and the fruits of the spirit that come from it. I know that us humans are flawed, but Christ's doctrine is not. The Restoration is ongoing, and I know that this is the church is true
Teresa9:45 PM
Yes. We all know it is true. And true means made up but true. Good night.
Wiramina9:45 PM
I'm sorry if I don't completely understand but I would like to know more of what you are saying. I feel bad for not being able to help more. Please feel free to reach out again to us by coming to this chat link: https://chat.comeuntochrist.org/Wiramina12053
Wiramina9:48 PM
You are quite unique Teresa! It was a pleasure meeting you. God Bless and have a goodnight!
Abish9:49 PM
Because For myself I know that It is true cause I felt this strong feelings that I never felt in other Church !!! And If there is mistakes its alright because I am a witness of his power in my life multiple times !!!
Abish9:49 PM
I know that the leaders and even me are flesh so it mean that we all make mistake but I know that the Church is perfect like his creator Jesus Christ!
Abish9:51 PM
We are just the one who make all things complicated! So sorry again to be human haha and also sometimes I feel like we don't really need to know everything because it does not matter sometimes but yeah have a great night!!!
The chat session has ended.
Now chatting with: Abby and Savannah
Abby5:27 PM
Hi Jasmine! This is Savannah and Abby! How can we help you :)
Jasmine5:28 PM
I was reading quotes by Gordon B Hinckley saying to the effect that either the Church is all true or it is a fraud, there is no middle ground. Is that true?
Abby5:28 PM
Yeah it is true! The true church of Jesus Christ wouldnt have some false teachings, it would be all true. How have you come to know about the church? :)
Jasmine5:30 PM
Oh. Well then, all true used to mean that the Lamanites were the principal ancestors of the Native Americans. The now says that is not true, they may only be among. So it is not all true and must be a fraud?
Abby5:31 PM
sorry i dont quite understand what you meant?
Jasmine5:31 PM
Oh really? What part do you not understand?
Abby5:31 PM
yeah can you maybe rephrase 'the now'
Jasmine5:32 PM
The Church used to define true to mean that the Lamanites are the principal ancestors of the Native Americans. No more. They now concede that they many only be among the ancestors.
Savannah5:34 PM
Okay, based on this question we can see that you've looked into the church enough to understand some of the group of people. We know that there are many things from the scriptures that we can't fully explain yet because it has not been revealed to us by God, but that same principle also applies to evidence regarding the people and the DNA evidence to support it. We know that belief and faith is not based on proven fact, but more so on the unseen. Alma 32:21 helps us understand that. When you refer to the Lamanites as true ancestors of the Native Americans, some of that research has always been underway, not just proven for sure. We are an imperfect people striving to apply a perfect gospel. As missionaries for the Church our purpose is to help you increase your own faith in Jesus Christ, can we help you accomplish that based on the knowledge you already have about the Book of Mormon?
Jasmine5:40 PM
I am confused, Hinckley said either it is all true or it is a fraud, no middle ground. You are saying he was wrong, there is middle ground. Ok lets proceed. But first you said he was right. All true used to mean principal ancestors, now it does not. So according to Hinckley it is a fraud.
Savannah5:42 PM
No, he was a prophet and he is right, if you continue researching and praying about the things you find, you will find those answers. How can we help you grow closer to your Savior today?
Jasmine5:43 PM
Prophet is only prophet when he is speaking as a prophet. So you are saying he was speaking as a prophet when he said that. So it is obvious you need more help coming closer to the Savior. How can I help?
[She ended the chat The chat session has ended.]